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sonof
Please ask the queries about rules in the new books here.

Lee
DanM
QUOTE(sonof @ May 16 2016, 01:00 PM) *
Please ask the queries about rules in the new books here.

Lee



In OI

Can you opt to take "Emotionless" as an existing neuronic character?
What happens with emotionless and the benefit of buying adept about emotion restrictions?

Yes you can, and adept doesn't change. It means its 30 seconds before you neuronics come back.

Lee
dnsmantra
Are Silverfolk really not outlawed anymore?

Where do you want me to post typos, misprints and so on for v16.2? (as I have a few).

Huw

silverfolk are still wanted, dead or alive.

Lee
GNW
If something is costed differently this time around can you keep what you have already purchased at old price or do you need to refund and re-buy it?

you get a refund and re-buy it at the new cost if you want to keep it.
Lee
iainwimble
Can a Troll who has gained 1/2 effect Fire go Fire Demon gain complete Immune to Fire.

Iain

P.s thanks to everyone who put their time into creating these new books.

they can go fire demon, but the restriction about resistance to fire still applies, so they don't gain complete immunity.

Lee
Helsvell
Can classes which do not have a 1st class buy-as (such as Leywalkers) but the new statuses? Can classes which start in two brackets buy statuses from both?

the status' are not 1st class buy as, they are based on your base class being in the relevant bracket. So if your base class is in the warrior bracket you can buy them. So for ley walkers they are scouts and druids, so can buy both.

Lee
Mart07
In Wiz Grim, would a Chromatic Wizard who buys Metallic Wizard only gain/be able to cast Jade if goodly and Onyx if evil?

Thanks,

M

correct goodly for jade, evil for onyx, neutral suffer.

Lee
BBB
Can High Wizards take the Natural Talent Status and remain a High Wizard? i.e. does it negate the class restriction about reading mana glyphs?

BBB

no

Lee
BBB
What colours can Faeries take? There does not appear to be a restriction on them being "New Colours" it just says "Standard Spell".

Have they changed or are the same as previously?

BBB

they have indeed changed. New fairies can be "new" (as in around longer than some players have been alive) colours. This doesn't let existing one change.

Lee
Leo
If I buy immortal to 6th but not the upgrade, so I'm immune to physical damage but not physical effects, can I still call physical effects?
What about damaging physical effects like poison?

Physical effects yes, damage no.
Lee
MattJ
Now that Word of Command exists (Bronze Spell) isn't Power Word Die now completely redundant (i.e. 1 is 4 mana less, has the same immunities apply and can be used as a VOP die in any event).

I agree I can't see any reason you'd want Power Word Die really, and if people want to respend it they can.

Lee
markradford
hi lee

thank you to you and all the other people who put time in on this project.

1 quick question so far I have purchased the table 6 total immunity to neuronics and in the new books you need psionic retardation .am I correct the above ability will stop working till the pre-requisite has been purchased,and if the is any other pre-requisites added to any other abilitys they would need to be purchased as well? seems correct but just a quick check

mark

[i] Correct it's 40 points more basically.
Paladin etc. Spiritual buy as has changed, so worth checking that out.
Pathed characters and casting mantics.
Fire elf and complete immunity to fire.
Having a position of power anywhere.
Can't think of anything else off the top of my head.
BennyB
Philosophical questions : Should toughened skull (immunity to subdual damage) still be there? And if so is there a description of subdual damage?

Nope, it is tradition smile.gif

I can't see 'e' skill for goblins anywhere, I think that this went before these books and was in miscellaneous meandering. Altogether possible that it has been deliberately removed. Just wanted to check.

Goblins don't get E skill, enjoy smile.gif

I'd also like to echo the thanks of all above to everyone who has been involved with putting the books together.

Ben

Thank you

Lee
Stuart
Given you can acquire new colour glyphs as specialists, can any colour wizard now read scrolls of them? (Wiz Grimoire, p.90, 4th Bullet Point)

Can Warlocks now read teaching scrolls of combat-related glyphs without an ability?

Ta

Stuart

yes and yes.

Lee
Ryan
Level Drain - Sorry Wraith's Touch...
Appears to have a duration of Permanent, can levels no longer be recovered without an external influence or do they still naturally return?

Cheers

It's always been permanent, since instant would mean they come back straight away. You can get them back just as you used to be able to.

Lee
Estarriol
Is there any difference in system terms between a longbow and a shortbow (damage grades etc)?

not at all

Lee
Estarriol
Scout Book - Specialist states that Quin becomes the new base for Surprise Blow. Does this include Greater Surprise Blows or is that still based on Quad+Backstabs?

yes it includes greater surprise blows.

Lee
Ironcore
Scouts (and wizards) - I assume they can now read any colour basic magical scrolls (apart from opposite if they have a colour)?
No alignment restriction for reading the 'new' colours?

Andy

Correct, except for jade/onyx and sabre spells.

Lee
Woad
Morning all,

I don't suppose it's possible to order the new books online/via the phone and have them delivered?

Thanks,
Jonathan

Email the booking lin and Duncan should be able to help.

Lee
iainwimble
Is count as 7th going to be removed as Steal Life Essense is no longer needed ??.

Iain

it is no longer on the tables.

Lee
Leo
If I'm an evil priest and I buy "servant if carnage" and then buy light of glass to stop being evil, do I lose the benefits of servant of carnage?

Yes

Lee
Rob
So...

Elemental bound - great new race

If someone is bound to a colour - for example an ivory wizard elemental Lord - can they multi race bound elemental (gnome) and still cast the racial spells and innates?

Similarly a red wizard gone mancer who has not second coloured - can he go elemental bound sylph (aka purple people eater) and have access to the racial spells and innates

Ta

Rob

If you have a specific restriction then you can't use the spells, so ivory Elemental Master would be out, as would a mancer unless they had them as a colour.
Elemental Master would be ok though, as they are not specialists and the restriction is on specialists.

Lee
BBB
So, I made an assumption about the wonderful new statuses that you couldn't buy multiples of them unless you were a dual class, like say Psi-Master, in which case you could take one neuronic and one warrior.

However its been pointed out to me that it doesn't actually say that anywhere.

So, can a character buy as many of them as they like with the usual proviso that abilities e.g. Extra life, spirits don't stack from other statuses and you just take the best of each?

And why are there no Statuses for Pure Colour Wizards? A lot of the statuses have benefits related to Specialists.

I know they are intended as examples but it would have been nice to have one for 'mancers / Elemental Lord types.

BBB

Each bracket is different and it says in the description bit for each bracket how it works. Wizards is only one as it represents how they learn spells, Druids can have several. it is intentional. Dual bracket classes (warlocks) can get status' from both brackets.
You answered the question in that colour pure wizards already have an ability in Elemental Master for them.

Lee

BBB
Armoured Defence in the Armour Master MC. IS that a 5 minute Rockskin style defence or a one blow defence?

Its not really clear. Seems pricey for a one blow and cheap for 5 minutes.

Also, was there any particular rationale for allowing Priests to buy innates of Advanced Miracles post 6th Devout Priest but not allowing Wizards to buy inates of Advanced Spells post 6th Archmage?

Or Druids, Arch Druid and Advanced Evocations for that matter?

BBB

5 minute defence.
Druids get the option of doing them post some of their status'.
I also want a difference between the classes, the big one is wizards can get over double the power of priests so seemed fair that priests have a slightly better innate buy as, which has always been the case.

Lee

Estarriol
If a class buys as 2nd class X as part of its base buy-as, does it buy as "1st class Any" in that bracket? (I'm thinking of Vivomancers if that makes any difference - do they count as a 1st class in either priest or wizard bracket?)

Vivomancers are essentially pathed from 1st level - does this mean that like a pathed wizard or priest, they could also multiclass to a different bracket?

Vivomancers do badly in that they are second class wizards and priests, so no they can't but 1st class any.
They are also specifically in two brackets and pathed rather than the normal being in one bracket and pathed to the other.
They have got better though (lost the buy as penalty) with the new book but are still a niche class

Lee
Estarriol
You can take 1 multiclass and 1 path to 8th. If these are both standard multiclasses (e.g. Warrior Priest paths wizard and multiclasses to Ranger), does this mean you get the buy as 1st class 4 times benefit for both?

yes

Lee
Ironcore
Wizards Grimoire

In relation to my previous question.
(P90 making scrolls)
Still reads that only New Colour wizards can read new colour scrolls

I don't know what you mean that line doesn't exist, no honest it doesn't.....

Just ignore it, it's wrong smile.gif

Lee
Ironcore
ATSE

How does 'magical concealment' differ from using 'solitaire' as both make you immune to elemental/mana sight?
'Solitaire' being a perquisite for 'magical concealment'

thanks

You can trigger magical concealment when you are carrying items, have attacked or otherwise broken the Solitaire restricitons

Lee
graham1980
I have just been reading the statuses at the books, and have a few questions

can a character purchase more than one status


Should a spirit warrior takes a status that grants power do they retains or does it become 0 until they take spiritual choice


conversely is the same true from above for vochstellen, i am assuming so.


Thanks

Graham

Each class has different rules and it says per class.
Spirit warriors can only use the spirits if they have spiritual choice, you are correct. Likewise vochstelen, wayfinders etc.

Lee
Estarriol
QUOTE(Estarriol @ May 22 2016, 11:43 AM) *

They have got better though (lost the buy as penalty) with the new book but are still a niche class


Thanks for the previous answer. Can I ask what does "niche class" mean in practice - are niche classes meant to be weaker than mainstream classes, or are they meant to have the same level of potential as mainstream classes but you need more work (yellow paper) to get there?

Another way of asking is that when you are looking at points apps, do you think "oh well you chose to play an X, bad luck if you wanted to be as good as a mainstream class" or do you tend to give the niche classes more latitude because they start out weaker?.

Thanks for answering this sort of question - I'm not meaning to be difficult, but I and I'm sure quite a few other players really value being able to understand how you see things.

weaker no, just less open to newer players. So Vivomancers benefits are all based on them being Elysians, and from there the being mancers etc.
They are very good at the lower end of the system (mantics early etc.) but as they go up the points a priest gone wizard, or the like, over takes them. Do they have potential, yes. But no one has really gone for it. The high points vivomancers have been class changes (soth) or perm died and rebirthed (Remstar/Bob) before going far enough to establish anything.
I guess hey are a bit like Power Warriors, people haven't done much with them so what is out there to publish is limited.

Lee

iainwimble
Is it right that Paladins who have gone Battlemasters can no longer as standard by Holy Words ??.

Iain

Not quite. In order to buy a holy word of any type you must have an innate of every miracle on the basic tree. So if you go battle master you won't be able to use some of these

Lee
graham1980
another question or two

Are 2nd class paladin UC and GK now in both the priest/warrior bracket

Also, the alignment chart for creating a miracle list has change, so am i assuming that in theory any neutral priest can have up to 9 spirits of goodly miracles on his list regardless of thier l/c outlook??

No Paladin etc. are just in the warrior bracket.
Neutral priests pick either good or evil and can then cast neutral and that alignment. Their base list can have up to 10 spirits of the relevant alignment. So C/N can have 10 good or 10 evil.

Lee
graham1980
Ok another one for spirit warrior but i think this will be the last one for a little while, honest

Can spirit warriors benefit from the free casting granted by power mastered (may cast 1 miracle from thier major sphere of up to 3rd once per hour for 0 spirits) and similar abilities??

Yes

Lee
BBB
QUOTE(graham1980 @ May 24 2016, 11:48 AM) *
Neutral priests pick either good or evil and can then cast neutral and that alignment. Their base list can have up to 10 spirits of the relevant alignment. So C/N can have 10 good or 10 evil.

Lee


Actually WFA under miracle list creation it now says that if you have 10 or more good spirits worth of miracles then it's a goodly list and if it has 10 or more evil then it's an evil list.

Which is a change from previously having up to 10 good made it LN and up to 10 made it evil CN.

Can we assume that is an error and it should be as it was previously that it's having more than 10 good or evil miracles stops it being a neutral list and that, as the new intention that you can be CN/NN/LN and have up to either 10 good or evil spirits worth of miracles on your list?

BBB

Yep it should be more than 10.

Lee
Stuart
Should duellists and kensai be on the list of characters who can get Contramastery all weapons (Y:10 and T:11)? I've always thought of them as better at it than warriors and monks. Maybe it's a points app?

Why does Greater Rainbow exist, when it's much better to buy Specialists 2, 3 and 4?

Stuart

Nope. They get to be good against swords a lot easier. If they want all weapons then it's go battlemaster or be a warrior smile.gif


Honestly I can't see a reason anyone would buy it, but it's been there for a while.

Lee
Leo
I've just seen that baronies Demons can be priests now.
It says that if they're evil they have to follow the spiter.

In light of recent events, can they now choose a different faith, or does praying to the spiter still work?

good timing isn't it smile.gif Spiter day stuff is still being worked out but getting spirits from the "spiter" still works at the minute.

Lee
graham1980
Ok. to much book reading to assimlate. Just been looking at the race book. A troll or ogre taking Onie or fortune from the amlesian status, day they gain human intellegence, does this mean if they are a wizard they no longer need to purchase thier way up thier casting levels. Like wise does this mean trolls no longer have thier restrctions on buy as because they were always based on trolls being thick as 2 shourt planks??

Similarly, those who were witchdocters become wizards, does this mean they may choose any colour avaible to thier alignment or are they still limitied according to the witchdoctor colour they chose??

and one for more spirit warrior, How does bound spirit work and similar work for them, i am assuming once again they cannot use them unless you have spiritual choice or spiritual acceptence.

It jus changes their intelligence, they still need to buy up their stats and have the same buy as. It just means they can roleplay normally.
Colour wise no, they are still limited on their base colours.

And correct on spirit warriors.

Lee
dhurrell
Races book
Spiritual vessel - the description talks about them abandoing the physical world and by 6th they're immune to all bar spirit.

So - are they purely spiritual and therefore can walk through walls? Gain Spirit sight? If not I'm assuming they maintain a physical manifestation, but nothing can meaningfully engage with it, therefore they could still pick up physical objects?

Dave

Think of it like a perm spirit form.

Lee
dhurrell
Again from Spiritual Vessel (races book)
.. and would Spiritual Nature ( 1/2 effect all magic based mantics) count as relevant resistance to X based mana. In particular I'm thinking about mantic Annihilation, or would they still need to pay full 120pts cost for resistance to black mana which seems extreme for a remote scenario.

Thanks
Dave

It means if a mantic comes from a magical base you have 1/2 effect, just like the 1/2 elf ability for spirits.

Lee
Rannock
Wizard's Grimoire, Page 25, it says that Vochstelen "may never under any circumstances acquire mana points".
I seem to remember that the previous ruling (as far as I can see on the forums), was that they may only acquire mana if the multiclassed to/from a class that was able to acquire mana points i.e. warlock or wizard.
Does this mean that this rule has changed?

David

If they go wizard or the like that's fine. I didn't notice it but it is probably badly written.

Lee
Nibs
Budokas now have "wealth and potion restrictions" as per monk.

Can they still use items?

Yes, they always had those restrictions.

Lee
Estarriol
Can you confirm that the removal of Supreme Sacrifice from the tables is not an error?

It was an error.

Lee
Estarriol
Warrior Book:

1) Contramastery vs Weapons - Is this a 6pt contramastery or does it work at 9pts if the user also has Enhanced Contra Mastery or Enhanced Counter Mastery?

2) Also, while I'm here: Contramastery can be purchased multiple times by some classes - can they also purchase Enhanced Contramastery multiple times?

It's 6 points unless you buy the ability enhanced contra mastery weapons, which is on table 11.
Nope enhanced contra mastery is only once.

Lee
BBB
Given the option to start a Berserker as a base class was removed in the change to the books prior to this one should there still be "1st Class Berserker" abilities available?

Or are they left there for anyone who wants to MC 8th Level Beserker?

BBB

er it's still there for the few individuals that plays berserkers as a base class.

Lee
BBB
Spiritual Innates for Paladins/GK/UC

The updated buy as reads as: “May now purchase innates of standard miracles from this tree at 10pts per spirit point. A higher level innate can only be owned as many times of the miracle before it. E.g. to purchase a two Total Heal innates they must have purchased two of all pervious miracles on the tree.”

Ok, the change in how Paladins/GK/UC buy innates so that they buy as Spirit Warriors used to buy* means that above the example given is now a little contrary to the new way that innates are bought.

For instance, if an AP has four innate Animate Zombies and two innate Animate Skeleton as part of his base list does this mean he can straight away buy two more Animate Skeletons to bring him up to four in total (as per “A higher level innate can only be owned as many times of the miracle before it”)

OR

In order to buy two extra Animate Skeletons he must first buy an additional two extra Animate Zombies to give him 6 x Animate Zombies and 4 x Animate Skeletons in total (as implied by the example given).

*BTW it was about time that the madness of the Warrior Subclass getting a better spiritual buy as than the Priest Subclass was fixed! smile.gif

BBB

it's not contrary really. Your 1st to 8th lvl innates are what they are. Post 8th it follows the rules about buying up trees as they are listed.

Lee
fatteacher
8th level Trolls get innate PAC +3. On the Tribal tables they get the option of +3 innate PAC to purchase for 35 points. I'm guessing one of these is wrong. Which one please?

the tables is a hang over from trolls getting 2pac base not 3.

Lee
JonMace
Mysttic - Neuronic Whip 1/3 levels - should this be 1/2?

No

Lee
Martinj
A couple of questions about Human Awakeners, particularly where they seem impacted by rules that seem more related to the Farfolk nature than being an Awakener:

Should they be able to buy Mind Bar?

Should they be able to acquire Read Languages, Read Glyphs, Rec Mana and Rec Spirit if they later acquire the ability to buy these (eg multiclassing)?

Awakeners can't ever make anything and can't buy make healing. Yet they can take the Chirugeon tendency (which requires you to have Make Healing) - is this an error?

Awakeners are listed as having access to tendencies 'as leywalker' - as they have their own section for tendencies in the new ATSE, should this be changed?

they can, but at normal not discounted cost for mindbar.
Nope, they are tough enough so can suffer the same restrictions as farfolk.
It's a hang over, but I'd say because they can go pathfinder and get make healing, and then take it.
And yes the leywalker bit should probably have been removed.

Lee
Nibs
Friars can wear light armour and have max AC6

Pure priests can't wear any armour and have max AC7

Is this correct? If so: Huh? smile.gif

be glad they lost a lot of the other crazy restrictions smile.gif

Lee
graham1980
Why is the cost of foundation of faith so expensive? in the case of grey knight/UC the maximum possible amount of spiritual innates gained is only 10 where as the cost of this ability is 125? why is it so expensive when it would be cheaper to buy innates?

AP's also get a repel good so it works out about right.
It means if you have wfa innates on your list you can get more, which is the only way.

Lee
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