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> Friday Topic, The trouble with triple.
RichardCraig
post Sep 21 2017, 06:30 PM
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So now that extended lengths have come to an end I thought I'd ponder on a few things which have occurred to me as I've been involved in events all across the points threshold.

The first is some thoughts about damage grades for monsters and the trouble with triple.

The trouble being, I'm not really sure as anything other than a warrior subclass is meant to survive 18pt triple?

I'm obviously talking here in the pre 5250 level.

Its actually really hard to get into max ac 12, let alone get the AC to get into 12 without stepping into the warrior bracket.

So part of me is interested in how people have dealt with this issue? Or are we now accepting that there is no longer such a thing as a 2nd rank warrior?

I'm sure that people understand this but I've seen a to of o class quad being statted which is an absolute killer for anybody not in the warrior bracket and I think with referees that the power creep of warriors now trivially getting ac18/21 with % and fractionals quad is completely justified but not enough thought is sometimes given to the other 80% of the party who need to cower away overtime they see a monster with e skill.

I'm not really sure what the solution for this is though as the divide between warrior and non warrior is the largest its ever been in terms of 24/7 stats which means its the hardest its ever been to stat effectively.

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BBB
post Sep 21 2017, 06:41 PM
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I think from a ref view point the trick is to not just rely on pure damage grades and mix it up with lower damage grades plus effects on top, anyone can buy effective resistances.

Lee and Miles Panama effectively demonstrated this last weekend by the combination of lower damage grades plus an effect such as Shock or Spiritbolt et cetera.

Regards 2nd Rank Warriors I guess it depends on whether you get to play the part or not or if you are expected to be front rank.

The point of 2nd Rank Warriors is very much that they fill holes where monsters slip past the front rank and prevent disaster.

Typically most 2nd Rank Warriors are capable of doing other interesting things beyond just hit things.

There needs to be a reward to playing a Warrior that can only hit things and soak damage and that is being able to pretty much constantly hit things and soak damage.

2nd Rank Warriors e.g. Spirit Warriors, Warlocks, Psi-Masters have easy access to supernatural power to bolster them in the odd fight and to allow them to contribute in other ways.

And even then Warlocks and Psi-Masters are in the Warrior Bracket and can easily get the requisite AC 12 with a range of not too bad published Damage Reductions.

As an aside Priests, Wizards and Druids got a decent boost on the 24/7 front with the Regenerating Power Pool MC's which are pretty tough.

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Kail
post Sep 22 2017, 11:08 AM
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I think there is a general lack of warriors because having power is more fun. This forces second rank warriors to be forced into being front rank warriors.

To be fare on refs they are stuck in a difficult position. If they do double plus effect all the points the warrior has spent on ac 21 is waisted. If they set just damage grades there are races that can be immune to them. I think you have to go for a mix.

I also think we need to return to party cooperation rather than self sufficient characters. If everyone was there to complement and support each other then other people's stats wouldn't matter.
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Ferro
post Sep 24 2017, 08:09 AM
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Nothing really new to add to what's already been said, except how I like how Edd statted on the 3 day.

If you used E, then your damage grade was lower. And I agree with that. Using E doing full damage (more than you do in cool.gif in the hope to land more blows than using O..... it's just... A bit rubbish.


I think those who have multi classed warrior to be a 2nd rank warrior also quickly start suffering.

My thug / ranger is going to be stepping out of the front line soon because I can't keep up with quad all day. And I don't have power to do anything interesting with or to power up when needed.

But in general I agree with what you're saying. You really feel the jump in damage grades.


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isbiraven
post Sep 24 2017, 08:45 AM
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When I reffed I had no problem in the warriors being preatty much immune to wave encounters... its kinda what they are ment for anyway.
I think that some people write as tho every encounter is ment to be a possible death for the party and they forget that IC this group are ment to be the big tough mercs...
I like to stat it so it is a war of attrition with just one or two equal fights mixed in and maybe a big bad at the end that is a real challenge for the group.

Maybe stating gets too mixed up with "they will only take 1pt a blow" and meaning that as a bad thing?

T.
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