Topic for discussing Black Guild changes |
Topic for discussing Black Guild changes |
Jun 25 2011, 04:03 PM
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#1
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Heldsman Group: Members Posts: 797 Joined: 20-September 07 From: bexley Member No.: 6 |
Please use this topic for discussing the proposed changes to evil faiths, black guilds and outlawing due to miracle list. The announcement is Here
Below is the proposal:- 'Churches and Hermit Priests are no longer automatically outlawed for their miracle list. Should a Church or Hermit priest have over 31 evil spirits on its miracle list, It may choose to be an outlawed faith. This choice must be made at the point of creation, and ordinarily cant be subsequently changed. For an outlawed Church, all it's members (Priests, ley Belivers etc) are automatically outlawd, and should they somehow be pardoned, then they are autmatically re-outlawed between events whilst they remain a member of that faith. For a hermit priest, should they be pardoned, the player may choose weather to become re-outlawed in between events. An outlaws Church may choose to be a 'Black Guild'. This choice is also made at its creation, and cant ordinarily be changed after. Black guilds use the published rules, and can be found in the Priest Handbook (Words from Above).' |
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Jun 25 2011, 04:16 PM
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#2
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Legend Group: Members Posts: 5,234 Joined: 23-November 07 Member No.: 39 |
I think it's a great idea. For donkey's years now the Empire has in many representations been basically lawful evil, and having this change simply introduces more flexibility into the system for people playing their characters.
Stuart |
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Jun 25 2011, 04:21 PM
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#3
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Deity Group: Members Posts: 12,464 Joined: 10-November 07 Member No.: 25 |
And thus clearing up some of the odd anomalies in the alignment system regarding churches.
BBB -------------------- Grey's Law: Any sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable from malice...
PS, Yes, I know my PM Box is full. Email me instead... (Which you can do through the forums email) |
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Jun 25 2011, 07:10 PM
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#4
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Mercenary Group: Members Posts: 1,548 Joined: 27-July 08 From: Medway Member No.: 608 |
So if im correct by this change, it means your not automatically outlawed anymore for having more 31 or more evil spirits on your List? instead you can choose to be outlawed or not? as the current system means if you do have 31 or more evil spirits on your list you ARE automatically outlawed.
Thus it would mean i could have say 40 evil spirits and still not be an outlaw if i chose to? Si -------------------- Thade - Ebony Fire Winter Rogue / Ebony & Jade Wizard
Gast - Mantic Chromatic Immortal Half Elf Wizard Geist - Iron & Empire Dark Spirit of Glass Hiro - Definitely not an Assassin Skarlon - Tryst Noclo Warrior with Spirit innates Simon - St Michael Paladin |
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Jun 25 2011, 07:49 PM
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#5
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Heldsman Group: Members Posts: 797 Joined: 20-September 07 From: bexley Member No.: 6 |
So if im correct by this change, it means your not automatically outlawed anymore for having more 31 or more evil spirits on your List? instead you can choose to be outlawed or not? as the current system means if you do have 31 or more evil spirits on your list you ARE automatically outlawed. Thus it would mean i could have say 40 evil spirits and still not be an outlaw if i chose to? Si yup, means exactly that. Phil. |
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Jun 25 2011, 07:49 PM
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#6
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Mercenary Group: Members Posts: 1,513 Joined: 24-November 07 From: Eastbourne Member No.: 135 |
Brilliant at last, Weldon Phil, and team .......
-------------------- Jay
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Jun 25 2011, 07:51 PM
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#7
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Mercenary Group: Members Posts: 1,548 Joined: 27-July 08 From: Medway Member No.: 608 |
Excellent! Welcome the change
Now to devise my plan for total domination as a pure evil Hermit Priest! Si -------------------- Thade - Ebony Fire Winter Rogue / Ebony & Jade Wizard
Gast - Mantic Chromatic Immortal Half Elf Wizard Geist - Iron & Empire Dark Spirit of Glass Hiro - Definitely not an Assassin Skarlon - Tryst Noclo Warrior with Spirit innates Simon - St Michael Paladin |
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Jun 25 2011, 07:53 PM
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#8
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Hero Group: Members Posts: 2,534 Joined: 27-August 09 From: Harlow, Essex Member No.: 1,166 |
Would these changes, which are cool btw, mean existing Hermit priests would be able to opt for a change in their base list to reflect the changes?
If so, that would be great or would it cause a power shift? Either way, great change Jules -------------------- Jules
Seth/800 Blades - 10k - Pure Priest/Budoka/White Wizard Kazan Toshimoko - 9.8k Council Yojimbo Xeno - 6.2k - Ivory Warrior/Wizard Dipp - 4k - Far Northfolk True Awakener Sosen Oku - 3.7k - Jade Dragon Shaman (Bene/Healing/Jade Wiz) Lt Benjamin Ford - 3.6k Nightsoil Comms Grey Knight Moru - 3.1k - Twilight Elf Utility Wizard - Abel - RIP (21/08/15) |
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Jun 26 2011, 07:34 AM
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#9
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Group: Posts: 0 Joined: -- Member No.: 0 |
Is there any benefit to be gained from chooising to be outlawed as an evil hermit priest by this system? I can see that there are reasons to remain as a black guild, but not as any other sort of outlawed evil priest.
How does the interaction of the Unholy Knight ability and being in a black guild work? Lucy P.S. <<Pedant Alert>> You might want to spell-check that before final publication... |
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Jun 26 2011, 09:55 AM
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#10
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Hero Group: Members Posts: 2,781 Joined: 23-November 07 Member No.: 87 |
So does a Black Guild at the start of creating it chose not to be a non outlawed guild now? .
Iain |
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Jun 26 2011, 11:12 AM
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#11
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Group: Posts: 0 Joined: -- Member No.: 0 |
So does a Black Guild at the start of creating it chose not to be a non outlawed guild now? . Iain No, the logic goes like this. 1) Do we have 31+ evil spirits? 2) If yes, do we want to be outlawed? 3) If yes, do we want to be a black guild? Black Guilds are a subset of outlawed churches. Lucy (Now pondering the concept of a "white guild" by the same logic...) |
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Jun 26 2011, 05:08 PM
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#12
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Heldsman Group: Members Posts: 797 Joined: 20-September 07 From: bexley Member No.: 6 |
Would these changes, which are cool btw, mean existing Hermit priests would be able to opt for a change in their base list to reflect the changes? If so, that would be great or would it cause a power shift? Either way, great change Jules Broadly, i dont see a big reason to change existing hermits... in the main, they will likely have added the evil miracles they want nyway (without becoming outlawed in the process) As ever, if someone feels they want me to look at a specific character, they should let me know/catch me at the caves.... Phil. |
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Jun 26 2011, 05:16 PM
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#13
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Heldsman Group: Members Posts: 797 Joined: 20-September 07 From: bexley Member No.: 6 |
Is there any benefit to be gained from chooising to be outlawed as an evil hermit priest by this system? I can see that there are reasons to remain as a black guild, but not as any other sort of outlawed evil priest. How does the interaction of the Unholy Knight ability and being in a black guild work? Lucy P.S. <<Pedant Alert>> You might want to spell-check that before final publication... sort of depends on your view i guess... some may see being an outlaw as an advantage but, joking aside, beyond being outlawed (which may allow certain non-standard progression) there is no advantage for a hermit. The Unholy Knight ability stops a UC from being automatically outlawed because of their class. They would still be outlawed by faith (should they be in an outlawed church). If someone were to commune or have add-ons to disc. outlaw, then they could tell the difference... but beyond that, the UC would still be an outlaw (so not very much point in buying it...) Thanks for the pedant alert... i will correct the typos/spelling failures later Phil. |
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Jun 26 2011, 05:16 PM
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#14
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Heldsman Group: Members Posts: 797 Joined: 20-September 07 From: bexley Member No.: 6 |
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Jun 26 2011, 11:30 PM
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#15
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Arch-Enemy Group: Members Posts: 6,236 Joined: 23-November 07 Member No.: 40 |
Devil's Advocate... (ha ha see what I did there?)
LE pro imperial characters are really boring/ten a penny and shouldn't be proactively encouraged. Before any changes to rules regarding alignment some meaningful rules regarding alignment should be added. Priests who buy extra miracles should be bound by their alignment. J -------------------- No of course I won't ref. Are you mad?
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Jun 27 2011, 07:07 AM
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#16
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Bridgewarden Group: Members Posts: 3,789 Joined: 13-December 07 Member No.: 238 |
Is it possible LE pro imperial characters represent a base line of what the population of imperial 'middle management' actually consists of (hence the idea that the Empire itself is LE in its meta-alignment, as opposed to the boring typical (ten a penny? ) benign fantasy kingdoms seen elsewhere?
I do agree that some basic alignment tennets shold be put in place, not rules as such but for places on say a trio of axioms. and then a paradigm of tolerance, how much those axioms are an internal code for the character ("I don't kill peons") as opposed to how the character prescribes the activities of others ("You shouldn't kill peons"). Moral alignment those could diverge from spiritual alignment, an idea i keen on -------------------- Jan McManus
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Jun 27 2011, 07:37 AM
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#17
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Arch-Enemy Group: Members Posts: 6,236 Joined: 23-November 07 Member No.: 40 |
Moral alignment those could diverge from spiritual alignment, an idea i keen on Yep. Me too. J -------------------- No of course I won't ref. Are you mad?
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Jun 27 2011, 10:06 AM
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#18
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Steve Louch Group: Members Posts: 898 Joined: 23-November 07 From: Kent Member No.: 108 |
Yep. Me too. J Looks like a very cool idea, i never really agreed wiht the logic of guilds being outlawed due to the amount of evil spirits on their list. Also damn you! i have gone through a great deal to make the Iron and Empire non outlawed and now you do this!! lol what happens to current guilds and churches? steve |
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Jun 27 2011, 12:02 PM
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#19
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Mercenary Group: Members Posts: 1,968 Joined: 25-November 07 Member No.: 148 |
Indeed what happens to Black guilds that exist?
-------------------- - Pants
"Stop quoting laws to us, we carry swords!" Pompey the Great 82BC VENI, VIDI, NATES CALCE CONCIDI Corrupting the youth since 1995! |
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Jun 30 2011, 01:54 PM
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#20
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Mercenary Group: Members Posts: 1,348 Joined: 23-November 07 From: check length Member No.: 58 |
yes could somebody do a list of which of the existing churches are black and which aren't?
thanks Richard |
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